Breaking down The Land (Chaos Seeds)

Discussion in 'All Things LitRPG' started by Paul Bellow, Jul 5, 2018.

  1. Paul Bellow

    Paul Bellow Forum Game Master Staff Member LitRPG Author Shop Owner Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    Some of us have done a bit of sharing our opinions about The Land: Chaos Seeds... Even with all the negatives mentioned, like Twilight, it's got the sales. While this has a lot to do with timing the market and his building his mailing list and group on the back of other authors' back matter, what does The Land/Chaos Seeds do right?

    Does the series have any redeeming values in your mind?

    Why do you think it's so popular? If you're a fan of Aleron Kong's books, let us know.

    We've tended to keep it real here at LitRPG Forum, but I want to show that we're not always negative or only pointing out the bad things.

    Why do YOU think The Land has been so successful? A combination of things? Or is there something in the books some of us are overlooking? I've heard lately from some that it's because they've invested so much time/money into the series, but how far will that take Kong?

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2018
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  2. RauthrMystic

    RauthrMystic Elf Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    I read it for the high magic content. There is magic EVERYWHERE! Though sadly it's not something Kong's characters really explore. The setting itself is nice, though nothing we've not seen in other novels. The frequent stats updates are nice on your first read-thru but certainly skip worthy. However it's something that is 'familiar'. It also uses 'every day' language which draws in a very unique crowd. The adventures the character goes on are 'fun' and engaging...for the most part. Did I mention the magic? Okay focusing! OH! ALMA! she's his absolute best character. With her we see a clear progression of her growth, not just in the numbers on her stats screen but in how she interacts with the MC and the world at large. Plus DRAGONS! ahem. excuse me. I'll try to think more on this. I will say that I appreciate you for even posting this as a thread. So many people focus on the negative. I was a HUGE fan of Twilight. It was the right book at the right time for me. I swear I read the series 2 DOZEN times...in a row lol I'm an avid reader. SO. anyway. Thanks. Hope this gives you some insight. If I can think of anything more helpful than 'magic' and 'dragons' I will certainly post it!
     
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  3. Windfall

    Windfall Level 18 (Magician) LitRPG Author Citizen

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    I've only read the first book... and although I didn't particularly like it overall, I'd say this:

    - There's a real sense of the MC 'getting things', and I do like it when people get things. Undeserved? Not sure, but I feel like it's a shopping spree, and I will admit it feels nice. It ultimately creates problems of sloppiness, where you end up with a billion things that you will never use again, but shopping actually feels wonderful.
    - I'll defend the writing quality. It's not great, but it's not bad. The humor is just jarring and out of place and not to my taste, but the writing itself is not bad at all, and it's rather consistent in its 'decent quality', which makes it a smoother read than books that are brilliant in some parts but stumbles in others.
     
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  4. Kidlike101

    Kidlike101 Level 18 (Magician) Citizen

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    I tried to read book one. Tried...

    I think it appeals to a younger age group as there is a lot of action, meta humor and cultural references.

    It's also heavy with the D & D seasoning as there is always some sort of magic involved be it a curse, magical creature, items...etc.

    And that's all I got. I wrote a full paragraph that on re-reading is just me grumbling about the book so deleting it and placing this disclaimer in it's place.
     
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  5. Alexis Keane

    Alexis Keane Level 14 (Defender) Roleplaying Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    1) Novelty - when comparing a book with a new premise to a book that's an old story that does everything right, the new premise will usually win out as long as it's not awfully written - Aleron keeps things new and changing and dynamic.... book1 - let's start a village... book2 - magic tree and dungeons... book3 - fight kobolds in underground caves... book4 - building up village resources and almost getting tentacle raped by an aberration... book5 - don't remember, I think it's just more dungeons... book6 - lets go fight some goblins... book7 - lets build/explore a dungeon, kill a lich in another dimension, murder a rapist gnome...
    2) No big quest - there's no major quest and no major enemy... the land is essentially a slice of life story... there's no quest to win, there's no way to escape the game... it's just a series of minor quests that matter in the moment (and never stop)... and while there is no major quest, there is ALWAYS a minor quest going on... which means there are new trials, new enemies, and no risk of the story ending anytime soon... what this does is make it seem action packed, quests are constantly being completed and then onto the next...
    3) Humor - hit and miss, and will suffer as the book matures... but the book's humor does mesh with a 14-20 y/o audience...
    4) Control of the largest LitRPG community
    5) Traction - Aleron's got a large enough presence that he's self-sustaining at this point... once you reach a certain size you generate your own wind as old reviews and organic sales keep you at a state of rank equilibrium... Dakota has almost got this, but not quite... the closest would be Travis, and even then I'm sceptical that he's at quite the same point
    6) Timing - Aleron was early to the market... being one of the first is never a bad thing
    7) Father of - if you don't believe in your book you're never going to be able to convince a reader to believe in it... in this situation Aleron sticks his balls on the dining room table... he believes in his books... and hey... he's got the title to prove he does...
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2019
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  6. grimshawl

    grimshawl Level 9 (Burgler) LitRPG Author Citizen

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    I enjoyed these books initially especially the first one. For me the things the books did right were a combination of things. First is the main character in the first book feels like an everyman. He is relatable and could be me or you put in a similar circumstance. Second is that the MC makes the most of the situation and since he is relatable you as a reader get to enjoy his progress and triumphs. This feeling becomes less as the series goes on in my opinion as he piles on stuff but initially it is there. Third the world he is in and the creatures and stuff in it is fantastic enough that you want to explore it and gain what it offers which is adventure. Those are the things that I enjoyed about his series. I haven't read his latest book.
     
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  7. RauthrMystic

    RauthrMystic Elf Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    I was thinking about this as I finished (again) book 7. Kong gets you to buy into his book through his character. whether or not the MC is a 'mary sue' is irrelevant. the character feels things very passionately. He feels an ownership of the building that gives the reader a similar feeling of ownership. We know the buildings b/c we were there when they were built. So in the end, the audience feels like it is 'their' village. 'mist village mafia' shirts and such are a great example of that (well that plus the authors merch skills). I agree with what someone @Alexis Keane that each book was it's own adventure. The only overarching quest is the quest to level up the village, which he hasn't focused on. The last book ended pretty dramatically and once again our 'hero' will be without his peeps on a new adventure for a demon. It makes you, the reader, want to know what happens next. SO you end up being more forgiving. (though i'm still not paying 8.99 for an ebook, that's just silliness)
     
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  8. Herko Kerghans

    Herko Kerghans Biased Survivor LitRPG Author Citizen

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    Having not read the books, but having read a handful of threads & discussions on other sites (and since typing is cheap! =), I think it's a mixture of:

    > As A.K. notes above, having grown past the tipping point in which you generate your own large enough gravity field. It's a bit like, if somebody was curious about dark/gritty Fantasy (having read nothing from the genre yet), they'll probably go for Games of Thrones: it's the biggest, well-est known out there.

    > Contagious passion: seems to be something most fans, and a good chunk of detractors, recognize in the book. The feeling I get is that Kong loves writing his stuff, and that passion is contagious. For a genre that is a lot about "having fun", that seems key.

    > With KU, bigger is better: if you liked his first book, then you'll have not shortage of stuff to read.

    And, of course, arguably the best marketing ("best" strictly in the sense of "produces results"; making not moral judgements here) in the genre.
     
  9. Thomas Davidsmeier

    Thomas Davidsmeier Level 12 (Rogue) LitRPG Author Citizen

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    It is so easy to forget that what WE LIKE is not necessarily what EVERYONE ELSE LIKES.

    I like complicated literary books that have deep symbolism and plots that crisscross and are almost confusing. That's my first fantasy book/series. Other authors have read it and liked it. But, I think it appeals far more to the literary type than to any particular market. OOPS. That doesn't work.

    Hence, I'm trying to write my LitRPG series differently and focus easier to digest stories that are more compact.
     
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  10. SpaceTurtle

    SpaceTurtle Level 5 (Veteran) Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    Aleron doesn't neglect marketing. He is behind the largest litRPG group on facebook. He owns the litrpg.com domain. He's not an idiot, he knows what he's doing. I think he does passionately love the genre, but he also wants to be the person that 'owns' it. I quite like The Land, but it can be a little too stat heavy at times, even for litRPG.

    His books are successful because he's put all of his experience points into marketing and put a lot of time into his books. There's no secret sauce!
     
  11. Jay

    Jay Hiatus. LitRPG Author Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    So I have read...looking at my Kindle library...Books 1-6. I bought them as a bundle back when I was first discovering LitRPG and everything said "oh, if you only read 1 LitRPG series this is the one!" and it had tons of 5-stars so I figured "Hey, it's near my birthday, I will treat myself!". So I have read the books and I am basing my feelings on the actual writing from actually reading the books.

    PROS
    • Decent world-building. It could be better, but honestly I like the ideas of the Land. I like the few hints of the races. I like the village building. I like the dungeon ideas. I really think he's quite decent at world building!
    • Definitely memorable characters. Love or hate 'em, you definitely remember them. So that's something to be proud of.
    • Interesting magic system.
    • Some pretty cool bad guys and settings.
    • The actual prose/writing itself is pretty good. Not perfect, but he can paint a decent picture and he strings words together well. I will give the devil his due and say he's a respectable writer in terms of technical skills.
    • Really, really good marketing. If he's a respectable writer, he's pretty damn exceptional at marketing and gathering a following. I admit to kind of being baffled how given his behavior, but he's apparently pretty charismatic.
    • Puts out books regularly enough to keep those followers eager. Definitely props for that.


    CONS
    • I really, really dislike the MC. I didn't start off disliking him. The first 2 or 3 books, he wasn't too bad. He's just gone downhill to being more and more arrogant, greedy, and self-serving and even worse he's getting patted on the head and praised for it! Like I'll be honest, I really thought in the first books, he was going to learn and mature up and be a leader as the series went on. Sadly, that is not what happened.
    • The memes. Merciful deities preserve me from the memes. Like the occasional one was fine. "Oh, haha, I get that reference." is now "Oh good grief, another one? You did one 2 sentences before! Come on..."
    • Total lack of agency in any supporting characters. Like if they're not mustache-twirling villains, they all just...hang around the MC being paper-thin cut-outs who just go "Oh, that's so Richter!" no matter how awful he is or how shitty like some badly done 80s sitcom.
    • The tiresome "dudebro" mentality. All women are nagging harpies or there for sex. That's it. And the whole "Women, am I right? Hurhur" thing even extends to his own damn familiar. He alternates between calling the dragon "my love" and going "God, she's SUCH a female. Ugh. Nag nag nag!". I find that annoying as hell.
    • Please for the love of all things gaming, finish some damn plotlines. He has a dozen or more quests that have been "pending" since forever and they're not even hard quests! "Hey, make some houses for your loyal villagers!" ain't been done as far as book 6! Oh, he made some forge thing that could have waited a little bit, but no, he wanted cool toys... There's the revenge quest and the this quest and the that quest... and he just keeps. On. Adding. Please just wrap up a few! Like I could get if it was some big, huge complicated quest and needed books to prep, but some of them are as easy as "Hey, go write a letter to this dude". Like geeze.
    • What is the author's weird obsession with rape and cutting off dicks? Like...wtf? That keeps popping up in books and it's kind of creepy how much he keeps on going back to that in what is supposed to be fun fantasy series. I mean, I guess it's going more and more toward dark, but man, what is with constantly castrating characters (both the main and others)? Ick. I don't mind some gore, but dude keeps coming back to cutting off the man-bits and I'm starting to side-eye him for that.

    Now, to be totally upfront, author's shitty behavior aside, the series isn't the worst by far. I don't think it's the best, but it has potential and it's certainly not as bad as some. Honestly, if the MC was a bit less of a douchebag, I'd probably like it fine. Yes, I'd still be annoyed by some things, but if Richter wasn't a huge asshole with an offensively overdone "dudebro" mentality, the series would actually be on my top 10 list. I will willingly admit that. I'm still torn between reading Book 7 because I know there's going to be rape and bad dudebro behavior and cutting off dicks...but the world is interesting enough that I kind of want to see how the dungeon goes, etc. So hey, I will give him kudos and props for that. Love or hate him, he's got a knack for making you curious about what's going to happen!

    I will also admit that he's a very, very good marketer for his books. He jumped on the LitRPG train and man, he bought up most of the railroads and took on over. While I don't necessarily approve of his tactics, I won't lie and say they aren't effective. He's successful. He's sleazy, but hell, he's making money and he's got a following. I have to respect that and I admit I wish I knew how to do that. I'd try my best to use my powers only for good, but I wish I had his talent for it!
     
  12. Viergacht

    Viergacht Thunderdragon LitRPG Author Roleplaying Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    All the women are nagging harpies and he's obsessed with castration, you say. Hmmmm.
    [​IMG]
     
  13. Alexis Keane

    Alexis Keane Level 14 (Defender) Roleplaying Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    I laughed way too hard at that!
     
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  14. Jay

    Jay Hiatus. LitRPG Author Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    [​IMG]

    Well played, sir. I just snorted my soda!
     
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  15. Kidlike101

    Kidlike101 Level 18 (Magician) Citizen

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    That's it. You win :D :D :D
     
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  16. Herko Kerghans

    Herko Kerghans Biased Survivor LitRPG Author Citizen

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    ROFL indeed!!! :D:D:D



    Not sure if it will still be funny when he trademarks "Freud's American Grandson", but well, let's wait and see!! :p
     
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  17. PokemonThug

    PokemonThug Level 17 (Theurgist) Roleplaying Exiles Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    Will comment more when I Will find more free time, not sure if you will the reasons. But this will be true feedback, extremely painful and real. As with any truth it is disgusting and no one likes to know it. But like Rocky says get back up again and fight.
     
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