Eagerly Awaiting Book 9 [SPOILERS!]

Discussion in 'Debates & Discussions' started by Johan, Feb 4, 2020.

  1. darkenedstar

    darkenedstar Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Citizen

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    Sadly i think his oaths would have prevented that
     
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  2. PokemonThug

    PokemonThug Level 17 (Theurgist) Roleplaying Exiles Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    "Twice before I have made a Blood Oath,” Ran’dolphinius pronounced. “Once, to my father, I swore to never to sit upon the throne ofYves and to forever serve his bloodline. I did so faithfully until the new King cast me from his service when he learned of my true lineage. With my father’s flesh now turned to dust, I hold that Oath fulfilled. My second Oath I

    cannot share with you, even if it means you cast me from your side.
    "

    I was always thinking that the second oath was to his mother dungoen.. still he was yet a baby then..
    I doubt that the second oath would be to the new king, Randy should not do that so lightly..
    So probably either to the Old king or the Dungeon of Yves.. Randy really want to find his way to the Yve's dungeon..

    I doubt the second oath would be do not steal shit from the architects guild lol...

    Still these are basic oaths.. one can easily control Yve's with a puppet King lol..
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2020
  3. Dragon

    Dragon Level 19 (Enchanter) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Working theory: Jobholders unlock technologies in areas related to their jobs, not just any technology they know.

    In the case of Krom his personal knowledge and understanding gained the village a few technological advances in an area directly related to his job.

    Randy's personal knowledge and understanding should kick in once technologies relevant to his job as town administrator are unlocked as options. That should be a pretty large range of technologies including top yvesian governing technologies.

    The same would be true with Sumiko. Once the right techs become available, her extensive knowledge as a healer and life master mage - key to the healer job - should land them a few technological breakthroughs due to her personal knowledge and understanding.


    We know technologies known by regular villagers are not available to the village as a whole. Its possible they can transfer them to a tech manual, but I have a feeling it won't be that easy. They should definitely be able to guide the scholars in the right direction though.

    Do you guys think techs granted by a jobholder is conditional on them retaining their Jobs? Say Randy dies after a handful of techs are unlocked due to his personal knowledge, are they unavailable again?
     
  4. ShoughtLoud

    ShoughtLoud Level 18 (Magician) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Probably not. They can magically share the knowledge of technologies without having the person go to the house of scholar ship. Richter does this with smithing tools 1 (or some smithing tech) where he gives krom the knowledge while not near krom, who was (shocker) in the smithy. I imagine the house doubles as a repository as well as a place of study.
     
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  5. Captain BlackJack

    Captain BlackJack Level 16 (Paladin) Exiles Citizen

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    Research needs to be done in order to obtain blue prints for structures. Those blue prints are a form of technological know how. When those buildings are built are they not a pure expression of technology?

    If someone explains the reasoning and need for specific structures are they not sharing their knowledge of technologies?

    Wasn’t Roswan asked about building a structure that he didn’t know how to build. Then one of the scholars said they thought they could help him build it. They were familiar with the building from working in it.
     
  6. darkenedstar

    darkenedstar Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Citizen

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    My personal take on the whole ‘free’ tech from a position is the assumption that they will be sharing that knowledge with their minions.
     
  7. Captain BlackJack

    Captain BlackJack Level 16 (Paladin) Exiles Citizen

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    Well you know that Aleron is all about “Free” education. I still think it has a cost. It was initially paid for by those who learned it. Ricther will pay for it in some manor. Those who share in “free” knowledge will have to pay as well. It might be in more unseen ways. Having to teach for free being one. Often things given away have little meaning to the recipients of those free fruits. The fruits of that knowledge could later be used against the MV as well. There cost to all action and inaction. Nothing is really free.
     
  8. Captain BlackJack

    Captain BlackJack Level 16 (Paladin) Exiles Citizen

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    Ricthers little padawans might find their own Sithian blight.
     
  9. Dragon

    Dragon Level 19 (Enchanter) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Depends. Are blueprints technologies or a combination of technologies and knowledge?

    Roswan was asked about building a structure and a scholar helped him create a tier 0 version of the blueprint from knowledge he had.

    Part of the gains from researching construction 1 is the level 1 quarry and logging camp blueprints.
    The primary gain from researching micro portals 1 is the blueprint. That blueprint is derived from the portal technology.

    Lets flip it around, can you create a blueprint without first understanding the underlying principles aka techs?
     
  10. darkenedstar

    darkenedstar Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Citizen

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    As far as i can tell blue prints are part of the tech and come with them. Of course the only examples we have atm are tier 1 techs. Not a great way to hypothesize.
     
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  11. Dragon

    Dragon Level 19 (Enchanter) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Well this is my opinion of how knowledge should be shared. I respect yours of course :)

    Knowledge should be "free". It would spread it to far more people who in turn would be able to put it to good use in their own lives and projects. Hoarding knowledge or demanding exorbitant prices for it slows down research and development. Often the same research is done over and over and over by different people caught up in useless competitions that only serve to waste valuable resources and time that could have been used to break new ground.


    In many countries, students pay a price for knowledge so far beyond its actual value that they end up weighed down by debts for their entire lives. This keeps many from taking an education in the first place and instead they accept low-end jobs that are at high risk of being automated away in the coming years. Not only do they generate less revenue per hour worked, they are also likely to end up having to go through the education system later.

    Free education is free only in that the individual does not pay the bill immediately, instead they repay them over their taxes if they succeed. The initial bill is footed by the community. Its a much better system as it allows people to err and still become of economic value to society, without having a damocles sword of debt and stress hanging over their heads for decades to come.



    In the land we see these two systems play out. On one side we have the exorbitant fees the scholars had to pay for basic training in the scholarly arts, driven up to such heights that they were effectively owned by their debtholder, the guild, with no hope of regaining their freedom for many years to come.

    On the other side we have the village and the "free" education system paid for by Richter, aka the government. Those obliged to teach receive a salary for their work, and students still work hard to get an education.

    Its a little similar to how finnish trials with "basic living income" proved to be a motivator for most of the people receiving financial aid, as they no longer had to jump through hoops writing x job applications a day for jobs they neither wanted nor were qualified for. Instead their focus shifted to bettering themselves in order to move forward towards education or a job.

    Very few people find being inactive attractive for long. Its human nature to desire to be of use to the flock.
     
  12. Dragon

    Dragon Level 19 (Enchanter) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Agreed
     
  13. Captain BlackJack

    Captain BlackJack Level 16 (Paladin) Exiles Citizen

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    I remember Roswan saying anyone could build a level 0 hut or version of a building. Wasn’t that a different conversation. That was right after Ricther came back from his trial. At that time Randy had Roswan explain the construction skill.

    Wasn’t it a latter point and time when Ricther asked one of the scholars if he could make blue prints or help Roswan build a scholars hut?

    Well Ricther didn’t need to do any research for the blue prints he drew for Krom. He only used his memory from earth of what his uncles still looked like. I guess Ricther can be an exception if Aleron wants him to be. If he isn’t the exception and everything is equal the scholars help should have worked if he could put it to paper. Although, I suppose Ricther is unlimited right?
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2020
  14. Dragon

    Dragon Level 19 (Enchanter) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Well anyone can build whatever they please. Blueprints just imbue their buildings with certain properties that enhance their functionality.
     
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  15. ShoughtLoud

    ShoughtLoud Level 18 (Magician) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    I think blue prints are awards for reaching techs, but aren't enough on their own to constitute knowledge of the whole tech. Aside from not being allowed to have techs before they're revealed, it makes a kind of sense. "Follow these steps and you'll get this result" is fine, but you don't necessarily have to know why you do certain things laid out in a list to do them.

    Also I'm thinking even though they need to be in a job to unlock a tech it's kinda bs they only unlock techs related to it. Randy and Sumiko have to know enough to cover Basic Spell Theory 1.
     
  16. Andrew Lynas

    Andrew Lynas Level 17 (Theurgist) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    I think that it was that Level 0 Buildings didn't need a BluePrint to be built, but I also think that in many cases you still need at least an idea of what is needed for them to successfully build them?
     
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  17. PokemonThug

    PokemonThug Level 17 (Theurgist) Roleplaying Exiles Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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  18. Andrew Lynas

    Andrew Lynas Level 17 (Theurgist) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Already posted that in the Not The Land Thread, labyrinth World, awhile back. (First ;) )
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2020
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  19. PokemonThug

    PokemonThug Level 17 (Theurgist) Roleplaying Exiles Beta Reader Citizen Aspiring Writer

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    How did others found that place?!
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2020
  20. ShoughtLoud

    ShoughtLoud Level 18 (Magician) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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