Sumiko - how much should Richter have paid HM in exchange for her services?

Discussion in 'Debates & Discussions' started by Dragon, May 12, 2020.

  1. Dragon

    Dragon Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Something i've been musing about is the value of Sumiko. Now obviously she is a sentient being in her own right, yada yada yada, but its also a fact that HM has made significant investments in training her. I'd imagine most of us would demand some form of recompense before letting her walk out the door or at least would have one hell of a grudge.

    We know from Sumiko that HM spent several decades training her so that she could crack through to become a Master in her own right, despite her affinity being 49% and it therefore being conventionally impossible to grow any further in that skill. Presumably the HT faction (if not HM herself) also spent decades training her before she reached her limit, probably another forty to fifty years at least for her to have become level 99 with such a cripplingly low affinity. Let's call it a century's worth of training, with HM's personal training for forty years as she worked her way up the nineties.

    In addition to said skilltraining its likely she also received food, housing, clothing, magic supplies, books, valuable spells worth tens of thousands of gold in total, medical training to the extent its used in the land, healthcare, and various personal care items. These may have been partially covered by her services to the HT.

    So how much do you guys think Richter would have had to pay HM in compensation to release Sumiko from her service if HM hadn't stepped forward herself and pushed Sumiko out of the nest (thereby also giving Sumiko a shot at living a life independent of her mistress)?
     
  2. Zentor

    Zentor Level 6 (Footpad) Citizen

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    Zero, as she was a straight up spy told to watch over everything Richter does. All the other stuff was a fiction. Richter didnt have a town hall so no diplomats could be sent. She has told Richter herself that she lived with humans before, hence her charging for everything, unlike every other sprite. So she wasnt living a sheltered life at the Hearth Tree.
     
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  3. Dragon

    Dragon Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Sprites live for centuries and Sumiko was decrepit enough to need a walking cane of her own, meaning she is quite old even for a sprite, especially as she is also a life master. For her to have spent a few years traveling the outside world during her youth is neither unreasonable nor proof of anything untoward. HM told Richter that she was sending him Sumiko, one of her closest confidantes, as an ambassador of the sprites as well as a healer. The fact that Sumiko owed HM her loyalty was never in question, for him to expect an ambassador not to report to her liege on important matters would be foolish.

    We know Sumiko has since grown loyal to Richter, due to him bringing back the pixies(allowing her to find her pixie meidon, and regain much of her youth. Not to mention maxed out life affinity) and allowing her to advance multiple levels as a life master. Her becoming soulblooded with him for what is ultimately a relatively small thing, makes a lot more sense if she is telling the truth about spending ages working with HM on her advancement. Plus the universe tells us Richter has given Sumiko her heart's desire, again implying that advancing as a lifemaster is a very, very big deal for her.

    Where do you get the idea that Sumiko was there as a townhall-supported diplomat? We know you can send out representatives without having a town hall, you just don't get diplopoints for it. Except HM probably has one so she would get points and even if she didn't it wouldn't make much difference.

    Sumiko charges Richter for new spells, not everything.
     
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  4. Johan

    Johan Level 16 (Paladin) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    it is an odd question. How much would she be worth as a tradable citizen. Seeing how annoying she can be to people around her, including the HM; I would think HM would pay about 100 gold to have Richter take her.
     
  5. Dragon

    Dragon Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Nah its tied into the larger question of how much a master is worth/ costs to train.

    It would be perfectly reasonable for HM to requirre compensation for the resources invested in Sumiko's training, thats not really trading as such, in modern terms you are basically buying out her contract by paying for her debts and obligations to a former employer,
     
  6. Waterhobit

    Waterhobit Level 9 (Burgler) Citizen

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    I think what Zentor was saying is that she is not a diplomat. The HM was unable to send an official diplomat since the MV did not have a town hall, although she did refer to her as an ambassador. The HM has said several times that she intends to keep a close eye on Richter. I think it is clear that part of Sumiko's job, maybe even her primary objective, was to keep an eye on Richter. Sumiko may or may not be an official spy, but she was definitely sent to the MV to act as one. Her loyalty has since shifted and is likely still split in some ways.
     
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  7. Dragon

    Dragon Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Of course she was sent to keep an eye on Richter, he had HM's only son with him. Even if Sion isn't heir apparent to the HT - pretty sure he is intended to marry the sprite girl introduced in book 2, with her becoming heiress - he is an important figure. Then there are the pixies which is perhaps an even bigger deal.

    HM told him Sumiko is both an elder and one of her closest confidantes.

    I do not want to infringe upon your hospitality, but would you do me the favor of hosting one of our elders? She beckoned to an older sprite who had been standing several paces behind her. “This is Sumiko. Her counsel has guided me through many difficult decisions. I would ask that you accept her as an ambassador between our two peoples. She is also a master of Life magic. I believe you would find her aid invaluable.”

    Kong, Aleron. The Land: Forging: A LitRPG Saga (Chaos Seeds Book 2) (p. 34). Kindle Edition.

    Now Richter, being an idiot, focuses solely on Sumiko being a life master. While that is an important qualification, that is far from all HM said.

    She further implied Richter could rely on Sumiko for council about governing decisions. She is polite enough to call her an ambassador rather than someone sent to keep him and Sion from transforming their new village into a complete mess and getting people killed unnecessarily, but there is no question she is placing a councilor at Richter's side.

    IMHO she is justified in having apprehensions about two noobs starting up a settlement and government with no prior experience. Mistakes will invariably be made, having someone who can cover for them while reporting to the one person who could stop things from spinning out of control makes perfect sense.

    If we look at what actually happens, it doesn't take that long before Sumiko takes over the two critical sectors Richter had failed to do anything about, namely health, healing and hygiene. Richter later contemplates the disaster they were headed for with the disease pit. Which was just dumb, but too many tasks placed in the hands of the untrained means things will slip through the cracks.
     
  8. Johan

    Johan Level 16 (Paladin) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    So are you then asking how much she would be traded for if HM did not benefit greatly in all the ways you have just listed. I suppose we can look at it in terms of the trade agreement. She is a master but not a professional, and it was only temporary like with the other professionals. So she probably cost 2/3 the worth of the trade deal already made.
     
  9. Dragon

    Dragon Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Basically yes, how much would it cost to acquire the services of a master that isn't being offered for political or sentimental reasons?

    There was no talk of Sumiko returning to the HT in book 2. No doubt that was the intention though. I was thinking more in terms of a full release from service, but it does make sense.

    I doubt it would cost the same or close to the services of a professional, professionals are relatively common compared to masters as they only need to be journeymen, masters on the other hand are rare. Also, with skilllevel 100 it was mostly a question of Sumiko taking the time to go for a weeklong trial, which doesn't really lower her potential value to another faction.

    Maybe double what they are are already treatybound to deliver?


    Sidenote:
    The wise sprite leader understood the unspoken question. She had known Sumiko for nearly a century.

    Kong, Aleron. The Land: Predators: A LitRPG Saga (Chaos Seeds Book 7) (Kindle Locations 10810-10811). Tamori Publications, LLC. Kindle Edition.

    Does this imply that Sumiko arrived at the HT at some point from elsewhere?
     
  10. Waterhobit

    Waterhobit Level 9 (Burgler) Citizen

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    I think it is more likely that the HM may not personally know every member of her faction.
     
  11. Johan

    Johan Level 16 (Paladin) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    I would have to disagree. The skill ranks only give 1 new bonus (unless you find the secret ones), and an increase to the bonuses you were already getting. A professional is able to be much more useful because they can buy all the very interesting talents that can help is various ways. It is also reasonable to imply that Sumiko could not obtain a profession because only a fool would not have gone for the profession once obtaining the required skill level, if they have the personal level. Not obtaining a profession after another 35 levels of skill...would imply something is wrong, like you would be purchasing a defective product. This would lower her worth compared to a little over a journeyman professional, but less than and adept professional.
     
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  12. Dragon

    Dragon Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    A master can use every spell in the gap between level 45 and level 100, including all journeyman and adept life spells. I bet you there are a lot of really useful life spells available to adepts not to mention whatever spells become available to newly minted masters. A professed master is going to be heads and shoulder above a nonprofessed master, a professsed journeyman/ adept not so much.
     
  13. Johan

    Johan Level 16 (Paladin) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    i would like to see a stat page for sumiko, and how much an master level spell costs mana wise versus her mana available, and how many spells a person can know.
     
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  14. Dragon

    Dragon Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    So would I. Of course at this point she IS professed, and she likely has fullfilled a lot of talent point quests over the decades as a life mage, so her power as a mage will be much greater.
     
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  15. ShoughtLoud

    ShoughtLoud Level 13 (Assassin) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    But Hisako's not exactly in short supply as far as magi go at the Hearth tree. I doubt Fumiko is the only other life master there, and I'm sure there are plenty who are on the rise to those or close levels as well. I think Sumiko is just old, and easily fits a grandmotherish role that Hisako knows Richter is missing as well as an easy pot sweetener for being a life master. In return, she'll get an eye over (or under in sprite case) Richter's shoulder as an advanced warning system should this wierd alien who is changing her corner of the world very rapidly decide to turn down a dark path or do something monumentally stupid.
     
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  16. Dragon

    Dragon Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    I think most of the life masters/adepts at the HT would be into their later middle years, maybe not Sumiko old but old enough that they wouldn't be fit for any role other than healer or mage. Becoming a master takes a long time for a sprite, longer than it does for a human with the same affinity and level of effort (at least if I understand the racial advantage of humans right). They also need to have sufficient affinity, but I could see that being relatively common amongst sprites. Especially those of the HT.

    Still, I don't think they'd have more than a small handful of masters, and maybe a dozen adepts.
     
  17. PokemonThug

    PokemonThug Level 10 (Filcher) Roleplaying Exiles Citizen

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    What has Sumiko gained?
    How much should she pay to MV for benefits achieved?!
    • Fruit of the quickening.
    • Reaching Healing level 101,102,103... 3 levels after mastery.
    • Bonding with Pixie.
    • Possibility to hit the dungeon, as a Master Life Mage and a professed Battle mage.. dude she should clear the dungeon by herself.. also unlock other magics in the dungeon, due to cultivation
    • Building an army of her own, master life mage army hehe
     
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  18. ShoughtLoud

    ShoughtLoud Level 13 (Assassin) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Not a battlemage so far, that's a specialty, but the dungeon should help her level plenty to get her specialization
     
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  19. Dragon

    Dragon Level 15 (Guardian) Exiles Beta Reader Citizen

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    Yeah, those would be the benefits of working for Richter.

    He should have asked for payment for the fruits. Even a symbolic five golds would have helped the royal purse a little.

    messing with her affinity levels without her permission sounds like a crime ;)

    the pixies are not the possessions of Richter, they are children that happens to live in a tree on his property.

    she could clear the dungeon on her own (maybe, it goes into how much combat power sumiko has, she isn't a combat mage, but she probably does have a lot of power). Considering Randy is already advocating a 50%+ tax on dungeon loot I don't think demanding payment for entering makes sense,

    army is a strong word, they are a team of healers ultimately loyal to Richter. Hardly an army.
     
  20. PokemonThug

    PokemonThug Level 10 (Filcher) Roleplaying Exiles Citizen

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    And what the ppl will buy with money?
    Food - free.
    Housing - free.
    Healthcare- free.
    potions, weapons - free, mostly, if there are potions to give out that is, as a guardsman ur not paying 10 gold for stamina potion.
    probably its all free if you work for the MV in any case..

    Learning spells - money.
    specially crafted items - maybe?

    The way I see it without a market, Villagers don't have a place to easily spend their $$$.
    I believe the dungeon will "mess" with everyones affinity, by doing this:
    Dungeneering settlement lvl 5
    40% to loot...
    Chance of improving ones affinities is 5%. everyone can get it. ur prob joking here
    Richto enabled for sumiko to find her pixie
    Healers army is now just some kids.. but 10 years later they will be a force to be re-conned with.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2020




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